Phu and Naar valleys

[yakshaver]

Has anyone trekked though the Phu and Naar valleys (to Phu and Naar respectivelly)?? They are located somewhere north of Dharapani - Manang portion of the AC. After Naar, the trek goes over a 5300m pass (narrow one, not like Thorung La) and rejoins the AC at upper Pisang. I got a current map of the area and it looks very interesting. Might want to explore them. If I decide to do that, depending on the info I get, I need a much longer time, I believe. There seem to be no technical climbing requirements in season.

[cmlama]

Greeting from Kathmandu.

This info is writing you more than 24 years experience guide/organizer.

Of course, Phu and Nar Gaon located north of Dharapani/Koto or for easy to understand; these villages are located backside of Pisang peak. There is possible trekking. You can pass Kang La 5350m After Nar and Phu village trekking and can join Ngawa/Honde trial of AC. Kang La pass does not require technical if there is no snow. It is little bit difficult to decent to Ngawa village from top of Kang La because of really down steep and windy sometime. There is few trekkers visit than Throung La because this trek is depends on camping. There is no teahouse at Nar and Phu village.

It requires special trekking permit to visit Nar and Phu Gaon. This is as follows:
Manang District: - Areas of Nar, Phu, and Northern area of Tilche Village of Thochhe Village Development Committee (For September to November per week per person US$ 90 and December to August per week per person US$ 75).

I have sent email with itinerary and briefing of Phu and Nar village. I hope that you like it.

Cmlama

[kolobar]

Did this trek last summer (hoping that high ridges will keep monsoon clouds&rains away).
There is a permit required for the area. Only one checkpoint - at the entrance into Naar-Phu Khola valley in Koto (just before Thame). There is no checkpoint if you enter from Ngawal over Kang la. You can reach Dharmasala - two huts permanently open for shelter - in one day from Koto. From there you can reach Naar village in one day. There are 3 lodges in Naar. To go to Phu it is necessary to camp. No lodges in Phu or on the way. There are all new bridges, fine paths and another shelter is being built in Kyang on the way to Phu by ACAP. Coming from Ngawal it is a long climb to Kang la with very steep last section - similar to the upper section of Mesokanto (Jomsom side). Must be unpleasant in snow but there was none in summer. Locals say the best season is september.
If you want to do it cheap - find an agency which will provide just permit, porters (with their own tent, stove...), and bring your own tent, food.

[yakshaver]

Thanks kolobar and cmlama for your valuable info. Sounds fascinating.

How big is Phu, what's there?

[kolobar]

Your question motivated me to create a gallery on the web with (not particulary well scanned) photos from Naar Phu. It is here: http://www.finnko.si/naar-phu/index.htm.

Both villages are small but lively. There is quite large nygma gompa on the top of the hill opposite the village. Nearby is a "magic" spring with healing water. Also the area is known for yarsa gumba - should be interesting if you visit during picking season (spring). You can continue from Phu along Phu khola to reach pastures (kharka) in the foot of glaciers&peaks further north. There is a side valley which was traditional way to Tibet - 3 days from Phu but difficult one crossing glaciers as I was told. So if the weather is good (not in my case) it is worth staying in Phu at least 3 days.

[yakshaver]

Thanks for the pics kolobar. I enjoyed seeing something concrete of the area. Phu and Naar look like fascinating places, and the treks there remarkable. Some questions, if I am not stretching the friendship...
1. Did you have to get any permits and pay any fees (apart from the usual ACAP fee) to get into those areas?
2. It looks like you went in the monsoon. What period exactly?
3. I understand the descent from Kangla is steep, so I assume if there is snow it could go either way... Sometimes snow makes descent easier, sometimes it makes it deadly... What do you think?

Second part of September, and early October, looks like the period I will go there.

[kolobar]

Of course you are not stretching anything. That is what friends are for :) - and forums as well.
You need a permit (beside ACAP permit) to enter Naar Phu area. The price was 70 usd per person for 1 week but it was said the price will soon change therefore 90 usd should be correct price.
You can not get a permit individually. It is issued by Immigration office in KTM only. Agency has to provide quite some papers to get one (registration papers, staff insurance, even a list of food supplies etc.). The recipe to make it cheap is to find an agency which will apply for permit. You dont have to bring guide, cook, all kinds of assistents, mess tent, toilet tent etc. what is usual on organized agency trek. I just hired 4 porters from the agency (insurance!) who brought their own tent, stove, basic food etc. so the whole tour was not much more expensive than trekking from lodge to lodge. One porter was actually a lycenced guide but in fact he did not act like one since he had not been in the area before (and I dont want to have a guide when I am trekking on my own). But formally our trek was organized by an agency so policemen on the checkpost should be satisfied (although when we entred the area there was nobody there to check). Probably there is a misunderstanding on Yetizone forum about same topic. Liason officers are no longer required on treks in restricted areas but treks have to be organized - it depends on your arrangement with the agency how much staff you will have but I guess at least there should be a guide. That there are no more checkpoints in all maoist controlled areas is another issue.
Timing: we were there in second part of July, beginning of August 2004 - monsoon time and I enjoyed walking by Marsyandi - very green, huge moisture, lechees, empty routes&lodges, Manang valley all pink from flowering buckweath. But I would not recommend it for the first timer on AC since views can be obscured for days and it is rather strange doing AC without seeing Annapurnas.
I was expecting we will be in rainshadow when we reach Naar - Phu but I was wrong. There should be great views of Kangguru Himal, Himlung Himal, Chulus etc. but in fact we did not see much. It was raining even in Phu and there was no point in going further along Phu Khola in that weather.
Kang la (Ngawal side) could be dangerous in snow - remains of snow can be hard surfaced and therefore slipery and first meters are steep and narrow. When there is no snow descend is OK since it is just scree. We did not have even a trace of snow. So considering your timing it should be OK (though winter 2003/4 was critically scarce with snow while this year there are reports of huge amounts of snow in Himalayas).

[yakshaver]

Kolobar,
Thanks a lot for the detailed info, this is very good. You made it very clear, so I now understand the situation.
Yes, I have a couple of trekking agencies who are a bit indebted to me for recommending clients to them, so one of them will help me out, I am sure. I plan to be there in the second part of September and first part of October. I have never been to Nepal so "early" in the season, my other trips have been mostly December, with and April thrown in last year... I have seen the Annapurnas in all their splendour, so for me it's the expeirence of going to remote areas that's more attractive. Of course, views are not unimportant, but at this stage they take second place. I just love the mountain atmosphere in no matter what kind of weather.

I was going to to AC with side trips Tilicho and Dhaulagiri Icefall, before this info on Phu and Naar came accross my way. Now I am set on this stuff.

I am sure as I get closer to the action I may have some other questions. I will probably send you a private message on the board, with my email.

Thanks again.

[kolobar]

I am sure your choice of timing is right - weather&views should be fine.
It is worth including Tilicho and Mesokanto since you will already have camping equipment. It is a short way out of the area since you are already acclimatized: 1. Ngawal - Khangsar; 2. Khangsar - Tilicho East; 3. Tilicho East - Tilicho North; 4. Tilicho North - Mesokanto - Jomsom.
BTW: I added few more pics on the net.

[zingzingla]

Wow, great pix kolobar!

Pix on Naar n Phu region are pretty hard to come by in the net. Guess not many people have been there-yet.

It kinda reminds me of the outer Dolpo circuit i did during late Aug-early Sept 2003 especially those awesome carved out trails that hang by the cliff.
It was a pretty difficult trek and we had to wait 4 days in Nepalganj for the flight to Juphal to materialise!!!

Hmm.... I'm definitely interested in Naar /Phu -keep this thread updated n if I'm free in Sept,I would really luv to come along!

In the meantime-m still waiting for companions fot my coming Mustang trek........................anyone?????

[yakshaver]

you're welcome zingzingla, please keep in touch.

[andrees*]

Thank you kolobar, i just love your beautiful pictures and i can't stop dreaming. I think I have to go there soon. This is really a great sidetrip in the Annapurna area.

Andrées from www.nepal-dia.de

[kolobar]

I enjoyed your pics&detailed description of Nangpa la as well. Might be an added motivation for the next visit to Khumbu.
Few days ago I was talking to a colleague who had crossed Nangpa la from Tibet (illegally, of course). After arriving in KTM her passport was stolen (or "stolen"). On the way she met organized group of trekkers from Czech republic crossing the pass as well.

[Sharon]

I'm just dreaming about this area as well. Looking at a month out there this Fall and then I can catch some of these amazing side trips.

[kegarne]

In March 2003 I attempted to cross the Kang La from Ghyaru and not Ngawal. We were thwarted by snow only a couple of hours from the top of the pass and decided to turn back.
Next time I go will definitely attempt the pass in Autumn rather than Spring as the snow was a big problem at this time of year.
Also another point to note is that there is no water between Ghyaru and the pass( or none that I could find) so make sure you have about 3 litres and you should be OK.

Anyway, I remember it as a magnificient day with the most amazing views of Annapurna II, Gangapurna, Anna IV and III. It is incredible and seriously worth a look.

[yakshaver]

Hmmm, I need my medication....

I am now obsessed about this. In what Sharon calls "the fall", or my southern hemisphere spring..., I will travel there. It is a bit more than a side trip, as it takes about a week or so to get back to the AC somewhere at Pisang. Am I right about this Kolobar?
Maybe November, I hope it's not too late. If not, October.

Thanks for the water advice kegarne.

[andrees]

have a look at the blog of Bea mahili starting from 16.nov. 2004.
There are some nice photos about a trek to naar phu and kang la.

http://beamahili.typepad.com/nepal/

and

http://www.dungevalley.f9.co.uk/nepal%20narphu.htm

from 1996!

[kolobar]

Right now I am away for work (in Bosnia, if somebody is interested) therefore I will not be able to follow naar phu discussion continously.
Yakshaver, I think you should go for more than 1 week so you can spend some time in Phu and go to kharka if weather is fine. I sent Andrees my itinerary to publish on his website. There you can see approx. estimation of time needed.

[andrees]

Kolobar has kindley allowed me to use his photos and sended me a detailled route description which i have added to my website. you can see it at

http://www.nepal-dia.de/int__England/EV_Annapurna/EB_Naar_Phu_English/eb_naar_phu_english.html

i guess I'm not the only one who has to go there soon-it must be a fantastic trek.

i like to thank very much Uros Sever aka kolobar.

[yakshaver]

Thanks Kolobar and Andrees. Much appreciated.
I will take into account the advice about spending more than a week in the area, and staying more in Phu.

[Unregistered]

I've read conflituos narratives about Bhote valley and Nangpa la:

- Both are forbidden

- One of the two is forbidden

- Both need an special fee

- One of the two needs a fee

- Both are open to general trek

- One of the two is open to trek

- Both need oficial guide do be done

- One of the two needs oficial guide

Actually, how is the trek situation for this trek? for the german site, it is open to all to trek there.

[]'s

Hendrik

[andrees]

Dear Hendrik,
you can find the official trekking regulations on the site of Department of Nepal immigration:
http://www.immi.gov.np/trekkingpermit.php

the Nar Phu area is restricted and you need to go with a registred trekking agency and a guide and tents and bring in your own food. You might find a guide who has an agreement with some trekking agency and organise this a little bit leaner. You have to pay 90 USD per week and an additional lokal fee . And naturally the 2000 NRP ACAP fee.
See http://www.nepal-dia.de/int__England/EV_Annapurna/EB_Naar_Phu_English/eb_naar_phu_english.html

The Nangpa la is not any more mentioned as a restricted area. When I went there I did it on my own with the help of a local guide. I had no extra permit and none asked me for one. The tenant of the namaste lodge in Namche Bazaar can help in organising a 6 day trip to Nangpa La.
Correction! 12. april Nang pa la is still a restricted area. I had not read wellthe trekking roules. sorry for that :eek: . This means you should need a organised trek. when i was there, all people from namche said, that you can go there without problem and there is no checkpost anymore. So it might be even more important to make it with the help from some lokal agency. I personnaly only know Palden sherpa from namaste lodge and he should be able to get the permit, but there are probably some otheres.

see http://www.nepal-dia.de/int__England/BKE-Travellogue_Khumbu/BKE-Nangpa_la/bke-nangpa_la.html

[yakshaver]

Thanks for this Andrees. As usual, we can count on you for getting facts. It helps me to understand thigs better now. Thanks again for the links.
Secondly, did the owner from Namaste lodge help you with Nangpa La? Or was it Namaste View Lodge?

[andrees]

Hi Yakshaver,
I organised my trek to nangpa la completely on my own. On the way we just met by chance Thukten in his lodge on the way to Thame, and we took him as a guide.
But i have talked and emailed with the publican of the namaste (view?) lodge and discussed, if it would not be a good idea to have a sort of "nangpa la package tour" with a local guide and the camping stuff from namaste lodge.
This would make the trek to nangpa la easyer and you would just have to rent a tent and stove and matrasses for 6 days instead of carrying al the stuff from Kathmandu.

I think that the "namaste lode" and the "namaste view lodge" must be the same, the publicans name is Palden sherpa.
you can Email him at paloutdoor@hotmail.com .
Viele Gruesse Andrées

[yakshaver]

I know Palden well. I have staid at his lodge two times, though not last time... Hotel Namche was too good to pass up, as my middle aged bones ached for a proper bed and better shower. But Palden is a great guy. He sometimes has genuine Swiss fondue on the menu, as his daughter is married to a Swiss fellow and lives in Switzerland part of the time.

[Unregistered]

Thanks for the usefull info, Andrees. Actually, I had see the site and there says the following:

"For the first 4 weeks per week per person US$ 10 and After 4 weeks per week per person US$ 20" for "Solukhumbu District (Everest Region):-All north-west area way from Thame to Nangpala of Namche Village Development Committee."

By that I did presume there is a fee to trek to the Nangpa pass and "The following restricted areas are open only for group trekkers". Sinds it will only be me and my babybother, I don't know if two persons are a "group trek".

Anyway, I don't know if we will have time, and money, for this trek. I only want to have a much as possible knowlodge of what I will find and what I can do there.. If I get in the EBC and back safely will be already a big victory.

[]'s

Hendrik

[andrees]

hendrik,
you are absolutely right. Nang pa la is still a restricted area. Maybe because in Namche everyone has told me, that there is not anymore any redtriction, i did not read carefully enough the trekking regulations. Or maybe they just added this area in the last days.
Soory :eek: :eek: :eek:

[Unregistered]

No problem. At least is only restricted and maybe two persons can be considerated a group. The info I had was far worse: it did says that all north valley from Thame to Nangpa la (specially Nangpa la) was a *forbiden* area. This did me to me that this trek was impossible at all. Restricted is not that bad. Just a extra fee. If I do have time, I`ll like to do it after Gokyo, via Renjo la.

Thanks again.

[]'s

Hendrik

[andrees]

Jes, thats a great trekking indead.
you can cross renjo la in one day from Gokyo and go down all the valles of bhote Khosi in one day. If you bypass lungen with the renjo la suport lodge you will see the two little huts of Aire. Thes are realy basic but i enyoyid very much the two times I stayed there ( One time to nangpa la, on time crossing renjo la :-)).
I doupt if after Aire ther would be any oficial person, so it might just be a posible to continue without any permits. But naturaly you never can be absolutely sure, but i thing about 95 %.
anyway you will need a tent and stoves.
Greeting Andrées

[Unregistered]

Thanks again, Andrees. Stove and tents were already at my gear list, because I plan to camp as much as possible.

[]'s

Hendrik